Star Trek Fan Games
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WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
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Author:  leandrovillela [ 23 Jul 2009, 16:27 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
I'm from Brazil, i really can help to translate the game from English to Portuguese (I don't know german)

If you are in need of Portuguese translators please contact me by sending a message to leandrovillela@terra.com.br
Author:  leandrovillela [ 23 Jul 2009, 16:32 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
I want to help by sending ideas too ... how is it possible?



Botf II is REALLY TOO SIMILAR of the Botf I!

I was really expecting for more. I really don't think that my tips will be possible tips in this stage of creation. I think que this contact should be earlier, but it's really not possible now. Anyway, I send this tips.

1 - One of the greatest things in StarTrek Series are the importance of singular people, It makes we think que individual people can change the world. It's similar the old greek heroes. But Boft, even being a great game, really forgot to use this. Imagine that each ship, or only the greatest ships have 4 posts to be filled. Capitain, Navigator, Engenier, Weapons. You would be able to hire some persons to fill this posts. Imagine the difference of an Destroyer with a simple commander and a Destroyer controled by Cap Kirk, even with Data helping him. There would be possible to make some this in other positions too. Exemple, scientific research, you should choose if you will send mr Spock to the reasearch data center of simple send him to help Kirk in a Battle. This strutcture of game is present in Master of Orion II (just one position for each ship, but I think we can implement it here)

2 - The other important thing about StarTrek Series forgot here are the moral judgents, many times the capitains had to choose between two or three options that should chance the entire course of the universe. This mecanism is present in the "Space Empire" series. Imagine that each race (or side) has some cultural indicators (exemple: Federation: Peace + Cultural Respect + Science / Klingons: War + Cultural Domination + Power / Romulans: Peace + Cultural Domination + Science ) and some events in the game triggers situations of moral judgment (exemple: You found a small planet where the population never gets old. There is a mineral found only in the planet in entire universe. This could be very profitable, or help the entire population of the universe. Here are your options
A - Leave this people in peace helping to protect them against any invasor + 4 morale for Cultural Respect + 1 moral for peace - 100 credit
B - Kill of the inhabitants and extract all this material to make better fighting suits + 3 morale for war + 2 Land Combats
C - Transfer the population to another world and mine this mineral to sell for other races + 3 morale for Cultural Domination + 500 credit
D - Diplomatic convince the people of this planet to study this mineral without taking it away from the planet + 1 moral for Cultural Dominarion + 2 moral for peace + 50 research point for BioTecnology.

Okay, this are only two of my tips. I really have many others. But I wll not loose my time here without knowing the programmers will really read it of even someone reads any think this should be possible.

I anyone want to contact me, please, send a message to leandrovillela@terra.com.br

Thanks
Leandro
Author:  Kenneth_of_Borg [ 23 Jul 2009, 19:25 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Thanks LtBlack, I look forward to your feedback on balance and bugs.

Thanks leandrovillela (aka Leandro) and welcome. I asked MOE to get back to you on just where to look for the text to translate. He knows that better than do I.

There is a good deal of planning going on about ways to make the game more like the TV and movie experience. The game is still pre alpha and many features are not yet part of the game. It is too early to judge.
Author:  leandrovillela [ 23 Jul 2009, 23:03 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
I'm not here to judge, I want to help. I'll be very glad to help. It's amazing you answered me and I really want to help with ideas. Who I talk to for helping with ideas. I don't no anything about design, a very little about programing, but I want to help you make a great game. I looked for the right place to write my ideas, but i could not find the correct cathegory. Could you help me? Or should I just post them here? Is there anyone I should contact by e-mail?
Author:  Matress_of_evil [ 24 Jul 2009, 00:30 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Hey Leandro, welcome to the forums! :)

I've replied to your comments in the other thread, so i'll just discuss the translation here. We're always looking for translators, but part of the problem is that the game isn't complete yet; you could start translating the game now, only to find that we're rewritten part of the text tomorrow. Translating at this early stage therefore means you'll likely be taking on a lot of unnecessary work.

There's also another problem; the game is actually designed to be able to support hundreds of languages. Entering translations into the game is easy - you just need to click on a special button that appears in the object information screen in the game editor for any object in the game. But the editor doesn't work at the moment as Mike is working on a brand new editor and he didn't bother updating the existing editor to ensure it is compatible with the last update, so you can't even do that!

A while ago though I wrote a post about how your translate the game; I posted images in that post to demonstrate how easy it is to do. The thread is Here if you want to have a look.

If you're still sure you want to translate the game, let us know and i'll give you more direct instructions on what you could start with. It will be a bit more technical and complex to do though without the editor, and as I said, you could start translating it soon but we might decide to change the text later on, unfortunately rendering the translation useless. :ahem:
Author:  leandrovillela [ 24 Jul 2009, 17:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Ok, I'll start translating later, when you have the final texts, or at least one semi final version of them.

But I still want to know more about helping with ideas.

I posted here some ideas, I really can do a board mixing the events and the possible options of them, but I need to know if it's possible these options could be use in the game. Or I can make a board with the staff that could be hired by both of sides and the effects of hiring each one, but I also need to know if it's possible you use them in the game. Even these ideas weren't good for the game, I want to help by ideas more than a simple mecanic translation. Is it possible? Who I need to talk to?

Thanks
Leandro
Author:  Kenneth_of_Borg [ 25 Jul 2009, 02:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Yes, we expect to explore an number of interesting options for the game design. Your input will help. Right now we are in limbo though waiting for Mike to get some free time. He is busy on a business project that is taking all his time. Just keep checking back. For now I am still working on content like models and artwork getting ready for the next phase.
Author:  leandrovillela [ 25 Jul 2009, 04:15 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Is there a simple table with all the variables of the game?

Example

Ships: Cost + Range + Crew + Officers + Scan Range + Missions
Space Combat: Speed + Attack Laser + Attack Missles + Deffense + Shields + Crew Damage
Land: Credit Generation + Energy + Food + Production + Inteligente + Research Points
Research: BioResearch + Military Research ...

and so on?
I'll try to create the entire personal (staff) modify bonus and pre-requisites if I have all the variables of the entire game. I'll star by Federation (of course) and if you (the big guys) like me job and say me that it's possible to use these in the game I'll make the others (Klingons, Romulans, etc.)
Author:  leandrovillela [ 25 Jul 2009, 04:22 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Sorry ... I found the table with all the variables. I'll be able to make the list of the "Hirable Important People" of the Federation, and if you like it I'll make the list for the other "Empires". I'll post this by 07/30/09.
Author:  Kenneth_of_Borg [ 25 Jul 2009, 14:31 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Thanks. We can upload it to SharePoint for reference.
:borg:
Author:  Matress_of_evil [ 26 Jul 2009, 00:13 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
I've sent a PM to Mike telling him about you and your ideas, leandro. Since he's busy he likely won't read it for a while, but they'll be there for him to read when he's free.

As for the ship and building stats, I wouldn't recommend making changes to the existing stats. Even though there are mistakes that I need to fix, I don't want to fix them without the editor. I *could* technically fix them, but there's a risk of breaking the game if you manually edit the files without the editor. Seeing as my updates eventually get sent to everyone, I thought it was best not to run the risk. .Iceman has been keeping me updated on errors he's noted and i've compiled a list of the changes that need to be made, so as soon as the editor works again I can get right on it.
Author:  Iceman [ 26 Jul 2009, 12:20 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
leandrovillela wrote:
Botf II is REALLY TOO SIMILAR of the Botf I!


I guess it's why they called it BotF *2* :D

Quote:
But Boft, even being a great game, really forgot to use this.


Not so sure they did. Maybe they just couldn't integrate it in a convenient manner in an empire-building 4X type of game. I'm sure lots of people asked for this already (I know I did propose a MoO2-like implementation). The caveat though is, this game, in its own basis, is supposed to represent the various eras of ST. So you can't have Picard as a Captain from "level 0" all the way through to "level 12"; OTOH, if he dies after a few turns, it's basically a useless feature.
Just because the original devs didn't include some features doesn't mean they haven't considered them. I think Supremacy is hitting some walls with some of those implementations; of course, there's no financial considerations with Sup, so experimentation is not a problem :wink:

Quote:
2 - The other important thing about StarTrek Series forgot here are the moral judgents, many times the capitains had to choose between two or three options that should chance the entire course of the universe.


Again, I'm not so sure. Do these sound cool? Sure. But. In a game like this, when you select a faction to play, you're already agreeing to some extent to play it in a given way. If you want to conquer the whole galaxy by force, the Federation is not your best option; doesn't mean you can't do it though. The fact is, each faction has its own way of being played, for a reason. The ships and buildings are geared towards that.
Regarding the moral choices themselves, well, some systems are empty, some have minors. In the latter, your moral choices are there: annex them, destroy them, demand tribute, etc. All have their diplomatic consequences. All have their own benefits (the minors' special structures and ships). Any other moral choices are simply a duplication. As for the empty systems, the moral choices don't really apply; there can be events, sure, but that's not the same thing.
Author:  LtBlack [ 26 Jul 2009, 21:25 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Matress_of_evil wrote:
I've sent a PM to Mike telling him about you and your ideas, leandro. Since he's busy he likely won't read it for a while, but they'll be there for him to read when he's free.

As for the ship and building stats, I wouldn't recommend making changes to the existing stats. Even though there are mistakes that I need to fix, I don't want to fix them without the editor. I *could* technically fix them, but there's a risk of breaking the game if you manually edit the files without the editor. Seeing as my updates eventually get sent to everyone, I thought it was best not to run the risk. .Iceman has been keeping me updated on errors he's noted and i've compiled a list of the changes that need to be made, so as soon as the editor works again I can get right on it.


~S~

Any timeline on the editor itself?
Author:  Matress_of_evil [ 26 Jul 2009, 22:08 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Mike hasn't been around for me to ask, so no. I'm from the UK and Mike is from America, so he's 8 hours behind me. Since he doesn't normally finish work until around 6pm, that means i've got to wait until around 2am before he's free. But since he's swamped under with his work, it's next to impossible for me to catch him on MSN. He'll start working on the game as soon as he can, we've just got to be patient.
Author:  leandrovillela [ 28 Jul 2009, 04:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
To Iceman :borg:

I know that the game should look similar to BOTF 1, but if you compare Civilization 1 to Civilization 2, the changes were huge, even in Civilization 2 to 3, or specially in Civ 3 to 4! Compare Fallout 2 to Fallout 3!

There are so many improves. I think people look for these great improvements when they look for the next game. I know that there is no financial support, but here in Brazil i develop games for students, I'm a history teacher. These are table games or card games, but I know a bit of "game logics". I understood what you said about the problems of "leveling" the "Great People" of the game, but if we simple don't level them up?
I know, some fans could be angry if they see "anachronism" using staff of different eras, but isn't this the spirit of a "simulation strategic game"? Each time I start a new game i start with new variables. First time I played BOFT 1, The vulcans were near me, the acepted to unite me in a few turns and they had some great ships with then. I played the game many other times and it never happened again. To be "fanatical" precise the vulcans should always be the first race humans contact.

I know what you said about the moral decisions are "anex" "make peace" "bribe" etc. But it's possible to make other moral decision.
Exemple
I'm a Klingon ruler
I find a peaceful precog race. Beint a Kingon I should attack them. But they offer me to reveal some weak point of enemy ships if I let them alive. If I acept I'll give a +10% attack against any other race, but the Klingon people will think I'm weak of not destroying them, so I receive -2 moral penalty. Or, I have a trird option, I can acept their deal and destroy them later, and it will generate the attack bonus without the penalty, but I have a 50% chance of they have prewied my actions and the potencial bonus were in fact a virus that sould cost +10% research in weapons field for 1o turns.

We can make 10 or 20 different decisions for each empire, if you think it'll become more like BOFT style. I really would like to make this list. I'm not asking for any payment. I just don't want to work for a month and suddenly none of my ideas would be used. So I'd like to first make a few ideas and if you say that they would be usefull I continue them.

If I really work with you a free copy of the game and a small quote to my name in the last line of the "contributors" would be nice. :wink:

But really, I want to help. I create so many games here in Brazil for the schools but I never helped to build a computer game. I think I'm a creative person. If you think that my creativity could be used (freely) in this project I really want to help.

You think that it's better this decision board than the Great People list?
Author:  Iceman [ 28 Jul 2009, 10:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
leandrovillela wrote:
I know that the game should look similar to BOTF 1, but if you compare Civilization 1 to Civilization 2, the changes were huge, even in Civilization 2 to 3, or specially in Civ 3 to 4! Compare Fallout 2 to Fallout 3!


AFAIK, this game (and its predecessors) started out with the intention to be what BotF "should" have been. So it's an attempt at improving the original design, which had its share of problems. They're trying to keep the spirit of the original, with a fresh look. Of course, only some selected topics can actually deviate from that spirit :borg:
As for huge changes, the UI alone is IMO a huge change, actually making the game playable :D There are a few more too, they just need to be streamlined and improved.

Quote:
I know, some fans could be angry if they see "anachronism" using staff of different eras, but isn't this the spirit of a "simulation strategic game"?


Hehe. Not in here. Canon rules them all.

Quote:
To be "fanatical" precise the vulcans should always be the first race humans contact.


Actually, they should be part of the Federation :wink: (humans start out as being the Federation).

Quote:
I'm a Klingon ruler
I find a peaceful precog race.


Minor race. Like I said above, minor races implicitly provide you those choices. If they join you peacefully, you get to build their special building(s), thus getting your attack bonus (or whatever else); the morale penalty is something the diplomacy can handle. If you destroy them, you won't get the building, and you get a regular star system.

Quote:
I'm not asking for any payment.


You'd be in the wrong place too :wink: There's no money involved here. It's all about fun and skill development.

Quote:
If I really work with you a free copy of the game and a small quote to my name in the last line of the "contributors" would be nice. :wink:


You can get as many free copies of the game as you want, you just have to download it several times :P The game is free. Due to possible legal problems, the game can't be sold. If it's ever finished :D
Author:  Matress_of_evil [ 28 Jul 2009, 23:21 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
leandrovillela wrote:
my name in the last line of the "contributors" would be nice.
Actually, everyone who makes a physical contribution that is actually used Supremacy - programming, artwork, models, textures, writing, sounds, music, voice acting, translations, etc etc, automatically get their name added to the game credits, which are viewable from the main menu. Myself and .Iceman are both in there for our contributions, and, should you or anyone else on the forums produce anything that is eventually used in the game, then their name will also be added to this list.

The names are entered based on the contribution type and the date the name is added (Decending order), rather than alphabetically or by any other system. Some of the currently credited contributors are no longer present on the forums for their own reasons, but their contributions are still being recognised in the credits list. Names may also be entered under multiple sections should that contributor make contributions in multiple areas. So, if you wish to make a contribution to Supremacy or the BOTF2 project as a whole (Supremacy isn't the only game we're supporting), please visit the jobs forum to see what you can do.
Author:  leandrovillela [ 29 Jul 2009, 02:03 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
You are making a free game! It's really cool ... congratulations !!!

Ok, I'll help just by translating it into portuguese and, if you want a "different voice" I can be a "voice actor" too, but remember I'm from Brazil.
thanks for reading my ideas.

When you need that translations and if you need the "voice acting" please send me an e-mail to leandrovillela@terra.com.br
Author:  Kenneth_of_Borg [ 29 Jul 2009, 02:36 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Thanks on both counts. I will be in contacted soon.

for voice acting:
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=2565&start=0
Author:  leandrovillela [ 29 Jul 2009, 03:05 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Ps. The Vulcans start with the federation indeed, but in BOTF 1 they are a different minor race and they are able to unite other empires (but the most of the times they become of federation because of the game rules indeed) Sometimes they even start in the oposite site of the galaxy.
Author:  Iceman [ 29 Jul 2009, 10:00 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Nope, the Vulcans are a seperate minor race in Sup too. What I meant was that the humans in the game are called the Federation, but everyone else from canon Federation is a seperate minor race. It's just an observation, not criticism. It's the only way to do it really.

And, like Ken already told you, you shouldn't be posting your email address in public forums. Use something like
xxxATxxxDOTxxx
instead, it's safer.
Author:  Matress_of_evil [ 29 Jul 2009, 12:27 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
You've got your email addy displayed in your profile leando, so all anyone needs to do to see it is to click on the email box that appears underneath any post you make to see what your addy is. So there really isn't any need to display your email addy. It's your choice if you want to, butdoing so often just draws the attention of spammers, and the forums have been hit by a spate of spam attacks lately. Me and Kenneth have banned something like 50 IP addresses in the last month alone.
Author:  Zweistein000 [ 19 Sep 2009, 23:07 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Like my promise in Game still being worked on? post I Rok Dretar (Zwesitein000) Would like to learn anything i can use to help you even programming. But i am a total n00b when it comes to music, pictures, 3d models or programming so would like to learn something to help you.

I must warn you that I am in Slovenian variant of Grammar school so my school work will take priority over this game --> SRY

Rok Dretar a.k.a Zweistein
(17 year old from Smolnik-Slovenija)

dretar.rok@gmail.com
Author:  Kenneth_of_Borg [ 20 Sep 2009, 00:32 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Thanks for the offer to help Zweistein000. Writing code would be a bit much to take on without a few years of experience. If you already have coding skills then send Mike a PM.

You might look at 2D art programs like GIMP with online tutorials. There is also Blender for doing 3D models.


http://www.gimp.org/

http://www.blender.org/

:borg:
Author:  Matress_of_evil [ 20 Sep 2009, 01:12 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Or alternatively you might be interested in doing some translation work on the game. Check out This Thread if you are.
Author:  Zweistein000 [ 20 Sep 2009, 07:33 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Well i can "code" a simple html site so that's a no-go for now about translation i can translate into Slovenian but there could be a problem because there might be something I don't understand or simple don't know the word for it, but I could get a dictonary so that is minor but I would really like to learn some programming if any1 could help me. 3D won't be bad since i tried it in google program and 2d if its drawing pretty pictures NO i HATE drawing.

So ill try to learn a program language or look at 3D stuff and maybe Translate

Who is mike actually (in forums) so i can PM him.
Author:  Matress_of_evil [ 20 Sep 2009, 17:39 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Mike is Mstrobel on the forums. His full name is Mike Strobel which is why the name.

Alternatively, if you want to help with programming the 3D combat system, you might want to to instead talk to CdrWolfe.
Author:  Zweistein000 [ 23 Sep 2009, 20:15 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
o I've sent a PM to Mike and CdrWolfe and I have already begun learning C# language but what I would like is a tutorial that teaches me everything that i need to know to help in combat system or the game.



P.S. I know now how to comkpile a .cs file into a .dll file but i dont see the reason. Why not just compile everything into a .exe intead of havinh 123534 files.
Author:  Kenneth_of_Borg [ 23 Sep 2009, 20:31 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
Mstrobel and Cdrwolfe are the ones that most likely can point you in the write direction.

:borg:
Author:  Matress_of_evil [ 23 Sep 2009, 22:28 ]
Post subject:  Re: WANT TO HELP BUILD THE GAMES?
There are very few of us that know anything about programming, so Wolfe and Mike are the only ones that can really help you i'm afraid.

Unless you're asking for help on how to play the game though, in which case we recently released a manual about how to play the game Here.

Instructions on how to use the Combat System are in the download post and are also included in the download itself.
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