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Trade Routes
http://bote2.square7.ch/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=3769		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  starfleet.command [ 07 Nov 2010, 18:36 ]
Post subject:  Trade Routes
Hello everyone, I have a personal idea to propose about "TRADE ROUTES.

- The idea would be that transport ships which we give an additional function can be transformed and affected into trade route (in a line, as in the game).
This function is called: "ETABLISH A TRADE ROUTE BETWEEN 2 SYSTEMS".

-Other ships (cruisers etc ...) could be affected in the same manner to protect the trade route in case of enemy attack.
Author:  Iceman [ 07 Nov 2010, 19:26 ]
Post subject:  Re: TRADES ROUTES
Problem is, trade routes are limited, by population in the system - I'm guessing by pop in _both_ systems.
Now, there isn't really anything concrete to transport (TRs provide income simply), but that would require that there would be a limit to the number of transports per route. The most obvious choice would be one I guess.
There may be a new feature in the game, which is race-specific trade items. TRs will probably have something to do with those, if implemented.

I had actually thought some time ago about Transports (Freighters) and TRs being used to shuttle food (and raw materials, if it was made a local resource instead of global) around, most likely using its WorkCapacity stat as cargo.
Some minors specialize in freighters and trade, there could be an angle there that could be further explored (they already provide more TRs, and have freighter/transport designs). Maybe their freighters could be faster, and have more cargo capacity.
Author:  Qinside [ 09 Nov 2010, 15:01 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
hm generaly a good idea,

I hope Supremacy, will not be to complex. That can crush the fun of any game.
Author:  starfleet.command [ 09 Nov 2010, 19:42 ]
Post subject:  Re: TRADES ROUTES
.Iceman wrote:
Problem is, trade routes are limited, by population in the system - I'm guessing by pop in _both_ systems.


I agree with you ICEMAN. It is true that we have a right to 1 trade route (2 others for the upgrade of the structure). It should be noted that once the neutral race agree (or offers) to join your empire, the trade route no longer exists and we can create another trade route with another neutral race.

I take an example with the Federation. When she signed a "trade agreement" with a minor race (or another empire), a small text or a short sentence would ask: "The Interstellar Trade Group requires sending a cargo ship to establish a trade route about the agreement you just signed with the ANGOSIANS.".(per example)

NOTE: In the Federation, "the Interstellar Trade Group" is a structure that manages the trade routes. Value: 1 Trade Route per system (Min. Pop 150)
Author:  Iceman [ 09 Nov 2010, 20:00 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
TRs actually are created automatically by the game (currently it's around 1 per 150 pop, depending on empire); you then assign them or not. Structures add to that number.
Author:  mstrobel [ 11 Nov 2010, 18:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
It's an interesting idea. But if we were to go so far as to have physical ships running trade routes, we would probably want to have actual goods for them to transport. That way there would be some sort of loss incurred if your transport ships are destroyed.

This sort of thing could be implemented as a complex mod; in other words, some scripting would be required. The game's design already supports custom ship orders, but there is no scripting interface for writing them yet. When that support is eventually added, this would make a great "expert level" sample mod.
Author:  starfleet.command [ 11 Nov 2010, 19:53 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
Here is a small and simple idea with PAINTBRUSH

- Create a box for the register and the name of a cargo
- Change the icon and replace it by a ship icon
- In the intelligence system:
create a function in the ESPIONAGE action to provide information on trade routes and the description of the trade goods they carry.
create a function in the SABOTAGE action to sabotage trade freighters (or trade routes).
- In the intelligence reports, add this sentence: "Foreign agents have disrupted the trade route between %SystemName% and %SystemName% destroying the %ShipName% (a Transport Ship)."

Suggestion: In the DAFEDZ's resource list, the ECONOMIC SABOTAGE could also affect these trade routes. Minor races that have this ability can also destroy the trade routes.

Attachments:
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Author:  Iceman [ 12 Nov 2010, 12:55 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
Quote:
Yes, and when the ship is destroyed, the trade route is also destroyed. Empire may recontact the neutral race and renegotiate another trade route.


Not sure why. Just assign another Transport to the route. Instead of a temporal limit, it could be a number of runs.
The way I see it, It'd be basically a Transport with a move order set to loop (with auto load and unload). That loop would be for X number of times, whether it'd be turns or runs. A Transport would only have that order accessible if the system it is orbiting has at least one free trade route (as per the normal rules); and the target system is in range of course.
We have to take take blockades into account (especially if there's auto load/unload). This will also drain your Deuterium pool - which is probably a good thing - in that it might make you have to choose trading over exploration and war (shame the Ferengi, as the economy driven playstyle, are gone).

There's a list with possible trade goods for minors already I think.
Author:  starfleet.command [ 12 Nov 2010, 13:04 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
I agree with your idea ICEMAN about the auto load and unload.
Author:  Iceman [ 12 Nov 2010, 21:47 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
Assuming there'll be trade items of course. I mentioned food and raw materials above because those would be obvious choices for things to transport/trade from one system to another - even among your own systems.
Author:  starfleet.command [ 13 Nov 2010, 13:05 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
Ferengi Trade Goods example: (with Ferenginar bonus system: Food, Energy)
- Holoprograms (Based on the MORAL in the system)
- Dabo & Tongo games (Based on the MORAL in the system)
- Snail Juice (Food bonus system)
- Slug-O-Cola (Food bonus system)
- Industrial Energy Cells (Energy bonus system)

Vulcan Trade Goods example: (with Vulcan bonus system: Food, Energy, Raw Materials, Dilithium)
- Kal-toh & Vulcan Chess games (Based on the MORAL in the system)
- Plomeek Soup (Food bonus system)
- Spice tea (Food bonus system)
- Warp Coils (Dilithium bonus system)
- Industrial Replicators or Raw Materials (Raw Materials bonus system)
- Industrial Energy Cells (Energy bonus system)
Author:  Matress_of_evil [ 13 Nov 2010, 13:35 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
*Edit - Lol I was typing up a list whilst you were posting, Starfleet.

If you go back to the .pdf's that Zeleni created, he's actually thought of potential trade goods for such a system. Memory Alpha also has big lists of foods and luxury goods that were desired throughout the Galaxy. Whilst I don't know how easy it would be to program a whole range of foods and tradeable items, we might be able to fit a select few of them in - assuming we actually implement a trading system as suggested above.

After a very quick trawl, this is what i've come up with.

Acamarian Brandy, Acamarian Parthas Spices, Allakas Malt, Altairian Fish Soup, Andorian Brandy, Andorian Ale, Andorian Tuber Root, Antarean Glow Water, Ardanan Zenite Ore
Bajoran Ale, Bajoran Jumja Sticks, Bajoran Kava, Bajoran Rekja Spices, Bajoran Springwine, Banean Marob Root Tea, Betazoid Gift Boxes, Betazoid Uttaberries, Bolian Souffle
Cardassian Kanar, Cardassian Yamok Sauce, Cardassian Zabu Stew
Denevan Crystal
Enaran Algae Puffs
Falangian Diamond, Ferengi Black Hole, Ferengi Flaked Blood Flea, Ferengi Slug-o-Cola, Ferengi Snail Juice, Ferengi Synthehol, Folnar Jewel Plant
Jevonite
Kibberian Fire Diamond, Klingon Blood Wine, Klingon Raktajino, Koladan Diamond, Ktarian Beer, Ktarian Merlot, Ktarian Psychotropic Games
Lobi Crystal
Maraji Crystal
Nausicaan Tusk Opera
Redjac Crystal, Rigelian Flame Gems, Romulan Ale, Rigelian Chocolate, Rubindium Crystal
Separ Gemstones, Spican Flame Gems
Talaxian Amber Spices, Tallonian Crystal, Tellarite Fizz, Tellarite Volcanin Spew, Terellian Diamond, Torothan Roast Teracaq
Vorta Rippleberry, Vulcan Jumbo Mollusk, Vulcan Port, Vulcan Plomeek Soup
Wadi Gemstones
Yridian Tea
Zaterl Emerald


There are plenty more out there.
Author:  starfleet.command [ 13 Nov 2010, 17:59 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
True, he wished to add bonuses as deposits of latinum, crystals rare and ancient artifacts. I think it's a great idea.
Author:  Kirktitude [ 15 Nov 2010, 02:25 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
I really like the idea of adding more to the trade routes, they were always so bland in BotF. I'd love it if you could transport surplus food to colonies with a deficit, like in MOO2. Also, having the ability to target enemy trade routes, or transports, would be awesome. I wonder if it would be possible to have the trade routes be based on pop size, but still needing a transport to go along the route. With deposits of money based on when it gets to the destination and when it returns. Maybe make longer routes require more transports? There are several episodes where they have convoy duty, so it would make sense. Forcing empires to defend their trade would hopefully make combat more spread out.

Also, just a thought, it might be interesting if you could conduct some illegal trade with minor races without a trade treaty to build up relationship points? or maybe even reduce the relationship points that race has with its current treaty holder. An option for giving humanitarian aid for races you've heard of that have suffered random events or been attacked by something might be useful as well. I really like the idea of having your relationships with other races depend more on other things besides monetary bribery...
Author:  starfleet.command [ 15 Nov 2010, 13:14 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
Matress_of_evil wrote:
If you go back to the .pdf's that Zeleni created, he's actually thought of potential trade goods for such a system.

So we will have such bonus icons soon? (after his idea)
One for the Crystals
One for Food
One for Energy
One for Gold or Latinum

Image
Author:  Matress_of_evil [ 15 Nov 2010, 20:20 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
No, I did not intend it that way, starfleet. I simply meant that trade routes, once established, might display some information about what was being traded, possibly including specific goods, such as those above.

I have no idea what Mike intends to do with this particular area of the game, so we'll just have to wait and see. But given what he's done with the rest of the game, i'm sure it will be an improvement over BOTF.
Author:  Kenneth_of_Borg [ 15 Nov 2010, 21:28 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
It would be interesting graphics to have trade ships zipping
around on the galactic map. We will see.
:borg:
Author:  Iceman [ 16 Nov 2010, 11:05 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
It might also get boring and unwieldy.
Author:  Kenneth_of_Borg [ 16 Nov 2010, 12:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
You are right. It would look best to have just that line
on the map to represent the trade as was done in BOTF.
:borg:
Author:  Edo Edo [ 19 Nov 2010, 17:40 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
I don't think we should get too wrapped up with finding race-specific items to trade. Remember that pretty much all races have replicators. I think trading items should be limited to latium/credits, technology, dylithium, cloaking devices, and maybe ships. If we put too many separate items on a list to trade, players would get too wrapped up with determining values of some goods vs others, which would distract from the main premise of the game...
Author:  vjeko1701 [ 19 Nov 2010, 19:08 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
Unless you are playing as Ferengi...
Author:  Valcoren [ 21 Nov 2010, 21:07 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
I like the concept of this idea; however it is a bit too "micro-management" I want to get to turn 2 under 25minutes if I could please.
Author:  starfleet.command [ 30 Nov 2010, 14:03 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
Qinside wrote:
I hope Supremacy, will not be to complex. That can crush the fun of any game.
Each strategy game has his own complexity.
Author:  praguepride [ 12 Oct 2011, 17:29 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
Expansion of trading system should definitly be penciled in as "post-alpha"

It's not critical for the game to function. It's not critical for the game to be successful (see BotF, trade was click-click-done)

Personally, I detest "checklist" items that don't actually add any real value or result in any real strategic decisions, but just make turns longer because of "Maintenance"
Author:  mstrobel [ 12 Oct 2011, 23:51 ]
Post subject:  Re: Trade Routes
praguepride wrote:
Expansion of trading system should definitly be penciled in as "post-alpha"
Nothing gets added post-Alpha, and ideally nothing new should be added during Alpha. See my response here.
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