Yes, hinges and hydraulics help the look.

Because the green wire frames weren't always showing up well in the game (largely because of the automatic display scaling) I played with a new concept. I have tried to take into consideration any past feedback. The background images are blurred on purpose to give depth and let the foreground images stand out.

BioTech: Simplified variation of past images.
Energy: A variation of past images.
Computers: Large curved computer core in the background. I Chose some LCARs from other races.
Propulsion: Most everyone likes the one similar to it. Background changed for continuity.
Construction: Mechanical arm carrying some kind of tank.
Weapons: A redraw of the old BOTF image with see-through torpedo in the foreground.

It's been a long Day. CB

Yes, I can see that it was a long day and worth the time.
You have really hit on something there. These look even
better. Less is more and the out of focus gives a sense
of depth.

One thing that helped with the images of our
3D models was the use of light effects. Just a image of
model in a single light source looks to perfect. I have been
trying to add in reflected light, lens flair and and other
special effects available in GIMP or Photoshop. Used
sparingly this helps the model look real.

It looks like you have used some of that as well.

KOB

You are of course correct. There isn't one picture with less than 3 light sources on it.
Here are both panels: I corrected the one above with the transparent backgrounds.

Thanks for posting.

Bashir.

Nice, top one looks more professional and filled out.

Regards Wolfe

It's settled then, we will use the top ones.

yes yes the top one. Wow that looks amazing. Gooooood work.

Can you post them here so that I can put them in my version of Supremacy?

Yes same thing for me. Supremacy needs a new kind of pictures without green lines. Gooooood work.

And this entire time I have been working with the green wireframes because I thought everyone liked them so much. They're a lot of work too, just ask the Matress. I'm still waiting to see if MOE, Zeleni and others approve.

Captain Bashir

I think I like the top ones best myself, except maybe for 'Computers'. However, do all our good artists know about the 3 new tech areas? We'll need images for them too.

yeah, the light green and orange colors could be improved in the computers image. Otherwise nicely done, captainbashir!

Great job Bashir you are defenetly talented for art. We all know that we are developing very polished and in every aspect beautiful game and Bashir i like all of your images but there is lot more potential in your images i would say you can improve them for 50%. I will now suggest few things how can they be improved in my opinion.

*.This stands for all images, grey color which represents metallic alloy looks looks like plain color not like metallic alloy, what is missing is gradient, gloss and specularity which is characteristic for metal.Blue color of wire frames, i like it but imo lighter blue color would look much better then dark one,maybe something like i did on talaxian frigate construction image though i think maybe even the lighter blue would be better:



1.BIOTECH- nice image, only i would bring closer colorful molecule for better impression.
2.ENERGY- everything great
3.COMPUTERS- i have impression that you struggled with concept in this image, frankly i don't like it, i think you can do it much better, maybe simpler would look better, something like star trek laptop.

http://www.originalprop.com/blog/wp-con ... ter-hr.jpg

I think dafedz did similar laptop for one of his 3d scenes and i think he would be happy to donate mesh to Botf 2 project.

4. PROPULSION- great
5. CONSTRUCTION-great
6. WEAPONS- great, though i would remove floor under torpedo turret doesn't look right for me and little bit of zooming in to bring both objects close otherwise everything perfect.

OVERALL GRETA JOB CAPTAIN

Do not be offended if I said that Supremacy needs new graphics without the green lines. I think everyone is looking for new ideas and images that Mike needs to build a game on a new basis and with new graphics. (and it will be a very glorious game)

I thought a Phaser Array rather than torpedo turret. This would highlight the Phaser Array & the Photon Torpedo as the 2 types of most conventional weapons used in Star Trek by all the empires & races.

Indeed, the more original graphics we have, the better.

Thank You all for Posting.

Some thoughts (givens):
I don’t think it is news to anyone that the mesh images were a simple technique to convey research, design and development. I think this is something we all agree should be in the images in one way or another. The color can be anything we like. The green was a light color and lighter colors may not scale well on different graphic systems. You can see what I am talking about in the second batch of images above. The darker was forgiving against the darker star background in the program. I made the change and the forum came to life with replies. I’d have to be blind to miss that.

Starfleet – buddy. I never saw any posts about needing new graphics without green lines. I’m offended. No just kidding. Actually, I wish I had known sooner. Personally it hit me like a ton of bricks this weekend. Mostly because Supremacy isn’t working on my Windows 7 install and I used another computer to put the composite panel image together for posting. What a shock (my wife hears me saying, “Dude that’s ugly”). I think MOE may have been trying to hint at it all along or maybe he was, and didn’t know it.

The original weapons image was just a test chamber. Again research and development. I can try a different chamber, I certainly did with the ENERGY image.

I thought about Phaser array but the Klingons have disrupters and the Romulans some kind of plasma weapon etc. Is everyone ok with it being so Federation?

Zeleni – When you’re right… (dafedz and Malvoisin too). Yes the computer image has made me crazy. I thought this was better, BUT of the six, it is the one I am STILL working on. Just what is the future of computing? All the Star Trek stuff is already here. We’re even talking to them and they’re talking back. On the other hand, what was in the shows was in the shows even if it is going to be behind what we have in the future.

Other thoughts on your post:
My 3D program has very accurate metal textures built in. I just chose and liked the “pewter” one. I’m open to change but did try a lot of things before I settled on the pewter (not that I think things will be made of pewter but they ARE large items viewed at a distance – the texture also at a distance). In addition, we are talking about “future metallurgy” after all. My guess is that it will be finer. There is an option built in for airbrushing and smudging things up a bit. But Scotty probably kept a clean engine room.

Biotech: Will have to rotate the molecule to fit in, or shorten the bonds but you’re right, it needs to be bigger.
Weapons: I already have a redo with larger photon torpedo. Construction has a larger mechanical arm too.

I guess I have commented on the rest. Thanks Mike for checking and posting.
I'll be in my workshop because this game is too good for anything else.

CB

Wow lotsa posts to read. Sorry for my absence but you guys all know the reason. Yes I prefer the blue wireframe lines as well. The green looks better in a stand-alone image, but as soon as the image has transparencies added and is viewed ingame, the effect is lost and many of the lines themselves become almost invisible. The darkness of the blue allows it to stand out even after the transparencies and that's why it's better. The BOTF images never had to contend with the issue and I blindly followed the BOTF system without thinking. I wish i'd realised sooner and experiemnted.

What's done is done though. The images definitely look better now though, but I agree about the computer. The colours just don't fit the image. It looks more like a disco than Trek. Perhaps you just need to replace the disco with some sort of LCARS style diagnostic panel?

You mean this one:

http://www.trekmania.net/art/readyroom06.jpg
http://www.trekmania.net/art/readyroom04.jpg

Man, you've got a good eye and a good memory, I would never have thought of that. It's not a very good mesh/texture etc, and was done ages ago. I guess it's adequate if you want to use it, but bear in mind it's in an old lightwave format.

@Dafedz-yeah,that's the one One thing more it would be nice if you can render for us all ships from trekmania that match botf 2 database in 270x225 size. Yeah i know you already did few renders but i would like to fill whole fed shiplist with renders of your high-poly ships where this is possible.

When I try to go to the Trek Mania sight I get some Access Denied screen. I am not able to see what you are talking about. I am VERY interested.

CB

Right click on the link above and take properties. Highlight the address and copy it. Now past it into your browser address and go. That should take you to the image.

Yeh sorry about that, it's just to stop those bandwidth leeches from hotlinking from my site.



*cough* all?! Wow that's a lot mate. What ships would you want renders of - ie that which we don't have already? As far as I'm aware we have a good collection of low-poly models ready for the game (from various modellers), aren't there any good enough renders of those? If not then no problem - I'll have to dig out and dust off some of those ancient models. It's been a while since I did any modelling.

Of the classes of ships in the shiplist (for Feds) that I have high poly models of are:

Olympic
Oberth
Hermes
Soyuz
Daedalus
Miranda
New Orleans
Constellation
Constitution 1&2
Excelsior
Niagara
Nebula
Ambassador
Galaxy

Do you have access to a cargo ship called Java Class? See it at Red Admiral. Like the look. CB

Seeing as I am the Red Admiral then yes, I do have access to it:) However the Java-class is not in our shiplist, and there's nothing in the shiplist that really resembles it.

We have some non-canon designs in the shiplist Daf. We had to create a few designs for specific roles like the Colony ships where no known canon design would fit. So if we put your Java in for one of those specific roles, it wouldn't matter since the class, design, and purpose of the ships are non-canon anyways.

CB, first of all, I love the work you've put into this, and you've got some serious talent. I know juggling work, marriage and "me time" can be difficult. I'm 35, married and have two kids and a stepdaughter, so I know the routine. I think in this case, less is more, and you've hit it on the head. There are four pages here of various incarnations of your original design, and I have to say, I liked them all. When it comes to modding, as opposed to commercial work, (which I've done) you're very much designing for the community, and the community can be exacting, especially when you're dealing with a niche like Star Trek. (Not that we're at all cult-like or fanatical. Not at all. Really.)

I also know that as an artist, sometimes (it feels) like the criticism leaves the realm of constructive criticism and becomes personal. Artists can be a little like mothers. We create something from nothing. I think at some point, a detail can be "done to death", and when a great deal of time is spent on one design detail, such as this, it both consumes time best spent elsewhere on the project, and wears down the artist. Nobody likes revisiting one issue time and again, and an artist can be "thought" into a corner and at some point it becomes counter-productive. I know Mike and I are on the same page on this... we want great graphics, of course, but function over form has always prevailed in Mike's project, and I believe it's one of the reasons it has succeeded where others have failed. Many are tempted to weigh down a project with "bling" and forget the GAME. Mike never has, and it's served him well. I just want to sound off a note of appreciation for everything you do, and hope that you feel that appreciation from the community, as well as HEAR it. Bravissimo, my friend.

Ditto what he said

Well if there's room for the Java to take the place of a transport then sure. The Java isn't my design though, it was created by my good pal Bernd over at EAS (See here). Also, it's designated as a Cargo Ship. I guess at a push it could take the place of the latter of the two 'Construction ships'.

However, if it is to be in the game we will require a low poly model of it. Low poly is not my area of expertise.

I am curious, why low poly models? And will they be at least better than the BOTF ones?