Keeping things canon, the only techs that a Borg invasion would trigger would be research into random weapon and shield requency modulation, which shouldn't take long. Maybe pulse phasers, quantum torpedoes, and ablative armor as well. At most, Borg invasion should trigger the research options of these early rather than being the only condition that makes them available since these peaces of tech and tech strategies are useful for regular combat.

There really isn't anything the Federation, or anyone else related to them, can research that would create real interest in the Borg. The Borg can already do everything the Alpha and Beta quadrent powers can do and do them better. The only thing the Borg are interested in humanity is their unusualy high resistence factor, in other words, treknobable and act of plot.

That's a bit noncense you know. Technology isn't developed into one line that everyone follows. Some races are more specific developing weapons, energies, biostuff. And it is quite possible that some of these races have technology more advanced then the borg have in that distinct type of technology.

Then what technology do the average powers in the Alpha and Beta quadrent have that would be better than the Borg's and make them interested? There are biological interests that the Borg have but these characteristics, if simply genetic, can just be reproduced in all drones after only a few samples of the original, or even one sample.

Well the borg keeps assimilating people and technology, because they haven't got the exact same type of technology. They want to perfect themselves and wait for the moment when some non-borg dude develops some technology, and then they strike. I mean what you are saying is that the borg already have everything and stuff like that, but still there is technology more powerful then theirs, they can be destroyed look at those trance fasic torpedoes, i know from the future, but deadly and developed by the Federation. So the borg won't assimalate usually pre-warp societys, but empires with advanced technology, which they can use to refine their own to perfect themselves.

The piece of technology has to be outside of what they already have for it to actually be interesting, or there had to be a biological trait that is of such value that it's worth assimilating the entire race to to get as much as soon as possible and for greater ability to analyze. In those cases though, they won't hesitate to assimilate the entire race. They do not like leaving behind resource they deam valuable.

Despite physical and technological inferiority, humanity was able to stop the Borg invasion. The Cube should have obliterated all Federation forces and completed its goal easly, but it didn't, despite it being an overwhelming force. This was weird but not an apparent trait that could just be assimilate, as evidenced by those humans who were assimilated. It was worth studying more but not pressing and humanity had no apparent traits or technology actualy worth taking.

Several years later the second Borg invasion occurs. One cube arrives, takes the long was to Earth, things go as planned, and wammo, the Cube is stopped a second time. That unusualy high resistence factor popped up again. So it isn't a fluke.

Not long after that, in Voyager, we find out the Borg's opinion of humanity. We're totaly inferior in every way but inexplicably able to resist. This is the one thing that intrigues the Borg and they seem to know it is something that isn't simply assimilated. They deside to try a different strategy, send an assimilation plague. The Queen wants 7's help, doesn't get it, and bad stuff happens. What the Borg are doing isn't proping the Federation for new technology periodicaly. They are occasionaly testing humanity with new methods of assimilation to be used against highly resistent beings. They are in effect carrying out a huge, slow, scientific experiement in their free time.

In the end what we have is this. Unless a race distinguishes it self in a particular way, the Borg just won't care, they'll take a few samples and that'll be it. The only way to make them care enough to come again would be to actualy have something then and there that they want. Then they'll come in enough force to just assimilate the entire race and take it all at once. They aren't in the buisness of proping races to have them do research for the Borg.

Although this is off the Borg topic, here's a list of some other structures I thought of

Tellarite Architectural School - +50 Construction Research points (if we still do research in this format)
Yaderan Holoprojectors - (No idea what this could do)
Corvallen Deuterium Collection Consortium - +1 Deuterium (needs a name change)
Zalkonian Evolutionary Research Center - +25 ? Research points
Jem'Hadar Memory Implantation Facility - +50 Ship Exp. (I completely made this up, no idea if it's a good idea)
Hekaran Warp Regulation Association - +25 Propulsion Research points (another that needs a name change)
Flaxian Assassin Guild - +50 sabotage
Deltan Pleasure Spas - +1 morale (name change?)
Coridan Dilithium Refinery - +1 Dilithium
Risan Jamaharon Resort - +2 morale

Orian Slave Girl Market. 99% happiness across empire.

No offence, but that's bollocks.

The Borg completely assimilate entire worlds, they don't take samples and move on. They want all races to be Borg, they believe that doing so brings themselves and all other species closer to perfection.

"You will all become one with the Borg" quote from Locutus.

They certainly prioritise the assimilation of technologially advanced species, this is presumably a result of their inability to evolve and progress independently. They also tend to ignore anything that's not a threat, perhaps for the same reasons.

Make no mistake, if they have their way the entire galaxy will be nothing but Borg.

They only assimilate entire worlds if the world has a population in the billions. In that case it's probably the homeworld or capital of the species and in that case they actualy want the entire species. But was we know they also can lift the cities off a planet and incorperate the people and meterials into ships.

By samples I mean the initial assimilated that the Borg use to learn about a people. Assimilation is how the Borg learn the most about a race, therefore it stands to reason that they take a sample, be it a few ships or a few colonies, which ever gets the best sample. But they will only assimilate the entire race if they actualy want it. We know they are picky, they didn't assimilate the Kazon because they were found lacking. We know that before Best of Both Worlds, the Borg had attacked several Neutral Zone autoposts and a colony but nothing else.

They don't want all races to be part of the Borg, they've stated what they want, they want perfection and 7 of 9 said this and the Borg expressed this in her example by not Assimilating the Kazon. In other words, those without any particularly singular ability. Assimilating them in mass would a waste of time and would hold back the collective by not adding anything to them but a drop in the bucket of numbers out of trillions of drones. If the Borg really wanted humanity they would drop right of of transwarp right near Earth, rather than take the long way at warp just to get Starfleet's attention. Then they would do the same and attack human populated colony worlds, maybe even attack them first to throw off Starfleet.

I wont argue about canon borg. I want those borg from early TNG when there was no borg queen or anything. Back then they were the mysterious menace that like a force of nature came about your empire wiping out ships, colonies (remember the Rom and Fed Colonies along the neutral zone in the beginning of TNG or the colony the borg wiped out in The best of both worlds) and finally would come for your home system.

That's much clearer now Diarr and makes more sense. I'd still argue they lifted the colonies off of the planets as they were the only thing there.

The Kazon issue is interestingly the only example of Borg rejecting anything. Their attitude seems to have changed since the days of "we only wish to improve quality of life for all species".

Zell's right, the borg have changed. They were a force of nature, destroying everything in their way in tng. Voyager gave them a personality, yet made them weak, even petty.

And why the f**k do they never send 5 ior 10 cubes to earth???

Guinen said the Borg come in overwhelming force when they do come. It turns out, one cube is overwhelming force against the entire Federation. The fact that humans have stopped two cubes is somewhere inbetween a fluke and consistent luck. In other words, character shields. The Borg are trying to assimilate the essence of character shields, it can't be done through normal means and the Borg know this because they've already assimilated hundreds of humans. But what they don't know is that if you find the one with the character shield, it almost always moves to some one else, some one close to them though. But maybe they do know this, the Queen said they were going to try something other than assimilation by cube. So they don't actualy want humanity, they don't want any race, they just want the race's one aspect or one technology that make them unique and better.


I agree, the earliest TNG Borg were coolest in personality. They weren't a storm, they weren't evil, they just were, and are, and will be. They're there and that's it and their is nothing to be done about it.

Picard actualy had a chance to total destroy the first cube actualy. If he had fired everything instead of poking the cube with one shot, he could have vaporised the entire thing in a second.

Agreed. Problem with that is the threat-o-meter would've gone up another few notches and they would definitely have sent a few more cubes.

Well, not two but maybe one more just to make sure they've actualy addapted and to get a few more samples of tech and people. Maybe that next cube would have come at the time of Star Trek: First Contact. In that case, Picard wouldn't have been held back and we would have had Best of Both Worlds as a movie instead of First Contact. That would have been cool.

That would have been a super cool movie. I love FC, but movie style Borg, Riker firing on the cube, very cool.

i sent a personal message to Jig a while ago now asking for him to confirm whats in whats not and what they do so i could update my list. No reply as of yet though jig so if your reading this plaese send reply or copy my list to your first post of this thread and update it.

i dont agree that the borg want to assimilate everyone and everything, that i reckon is bollocks

in voyager the queen stated that the Borg decided not to assimilate some Kazon they encountered, when asked why she said

"why would we assimilate a species that would detract from our own perfection"

now regardless of what the Borg started off as in the series, the writers have saw fit to change that to the technologically advanced Nazis you see today.

why the Borg take a special, yet fairly unexplainable interest in humanity is simple, the writers want them too.

reading trekkies musing`s on star trek like it is some kind of truth can really be trying sometimes, which for all its worth is essentially written by some pretty bad writers who cant stick to the established facts of the franchise because they need episodes to be filled with character development. I realise of course that this makes my previous statement fairly redundant, but maybe you`ll all think back to this little rant the next time you push up your glasses and prepare to out-trek someone

You're right about the Kazon. The way I see it the closer the Borg get to perfection, the less species they'll be interested in. They gain new strengths and technologies from assimilation it from others, they had nothing to gain from the Kazon.

I think you're being a little patronising and condescending with the last part of your post. You make it sound like everyone here is a deluded nerd. Believe it or not we are aware that trek is fictional, and that the writing's not always perfect. It can however be fun to debate certain aspects and see if any consistent truths can be found from the episodes. If you don't enjoy those kinds of debates then don't participate in them. Nobody here is out-trekking anyone else, we're merely discussing the way things are portrayed in the shows, so as to give the game a more 'realistic' feel.

If that's beyond your comprehension then don't post. Don't get me wrong, a reality check every one in a while is helpful, personal insults aren't.

my condesending tone in the post derives solely from reading your complete dismissal of someones argument as "bollocks". I understand that this isnt the best medium for expressing the emotional content of someones statement, and perhaps i mis-read it to be something more sinister. The way i read it however suggested a typical trek fan with a superiority complex. Im glad to see your reply reveals otherwise

peace out dude

I just re-read the post in question. I guess I was having a bad day!

If your previous post is in direct response to that statement and not the members of this forum in general then you were justified. I read it as someone who had a distinct disliking for any trekkie who enjoyed debating facets of the show, ie the people here. As this doesn't seem to be the case then I have no objections to your post at all.

Peace declared.

And the Borg?! Where are their special buildings? RACISTS!

How about these?

The Borg Propaganda Center! +50% Drone happiness
Unimatrix 0! +30% chance of rebelion
The ONE VOICE traning center! makes Borg sound more frightning
The Pithagora Shipyards! Finds new geometric shapes for Borg ships

:?: (:lol:)

I've had some ideas for systems, buildings, and development;
I don't know how far you are in working with them, but here they
are anyway:

1. I really like the idea that appeared earlier, that planet-type
specific structures (aquaculture centers, wind turbines, etc)
can be placed on as many planets of the needed type there
are in they system, i.e. if there are two oceanic planets you
can build two aquaculture centers, etc.

2. In a related matter, could you change the Wind Turbines to
work on Desert planets only, instead of Barren planets. I mean
seriously, barren planets in reality don't have atmospheres!

3. I have heard of the ideas of having a strictly canon game
variant. I hope that this happens, but also that there are
variants that the empires start out pretty much even, and in
random locations. Anyway, in the 'canon' game, could you have
the systems have planets that are consistent with what we see
in canon?

4. A few ideas about terraforming; I do like the way that BoTF I
does terraforming, but this might make it interesting. Suppose
we have colony ships only able to terraform one planet, and then
colonize. Later, you can build a 'Terraforming Station' in the colony
that will finish the terraforming job. I think this would reflect what
we see in Trek more accurately, and make colony growth a little
more realistic. I know this is different, but I think it would be
interesting. What do you think?

5. Could we have Crew Training Center Extensions to other colonies?
You could only build them if you had the central Training Center,
and they wouldn't do as much, but at least you could train crews
closer to the front. Seriously, are we to expect that one Starfleet
Academy campus trains the entire fleet (I know it only trains officers,
but surely other enlistees and NCO's would train somewhere?). We
see crews running battle drills and training on holodecks, so only one
training structure is a little silly, don't you think?

6. Could there be structures that either reduce ship maintenance costs
or use outposts or some sort of supply ship/tender to help keep
population support costs down? I also like the idea of a 'super
shipyard complex', as it reflects what we see better, and would allow
ships to be built faster!

I hope you guys think these are good ideas, or let me know if something
similar is in the offing. Thanks.

1. I totally agree.

2. That makes sense, I agree.

3. Not sure what theyre planning with this.

4. This is an interesting idea. I wouldnt mind it being like this, but I just dont see it happening.

5. It makes sense to think that not all the training happens in Sol, but what would you want these Crew Center Training Extensions to do exactly?

6. It would be nice to have a structure like this, perhaps there could be some kind of generic structure that did this available to all races at a somewhat late time of the game.

My two cents.

1. Agreed.

2. Yes but, if there is no atmosphere do the colonists live in enviromental suits or under ground? I know I wouldn't colonise there.

3. You mean a "cannon map"? If so, the game will have random star settings, but SonOfMogh and iwulff said they are planing a cannon Trek map. If that was your question... If not , I don't get it.

4. I don't know... Why just not terraform your self... Although I can think of situations where this would come handy (you don't have time to terraform everything because the other guy is sending his own colony ship)

5. Do we actualy know how many people on board ships are officers and how many are enlisted? I like the idea of not having to rely solely on Sol's Academy for troops, but it needs refining.

6. I don't get the first part, but about the shipyards; they were discussed in one of the active threads. Sol might be bonused, since we know of at least 2 shipyards in it (the San Francisco yard, and Utopia), a stardock, and probably many repair and refit stations in orbits.

The game will have the facility to generate random maps.

It will also have the ability to save and load up pre-designed maps.

Wulff and I plan to create a completely canon map, with everyone pretty close to where they should be. Once that basic framework is in place, we'll be able to alter the starting conditions, meaning there can be several variants available to download. Most notably, a variant based at the very outset of the Dominion War.

Sounds good to me.

Just wondering, have you guys started that map yet?

What... No Pithagora shipyards? Fine

Hey, you'll be able to put in completly new buildings in the game?
Not have to replace them.

I assumed that you would be able to to create a new building from scratch, since this game is gonna be ultimately moddable

I hated the fact that I had to get rid of some of the buildings, to be able to have what i wanted when I modded the game. Just think though, you really could have your Pythagora's ship yards if you wanted CVN!

One though though, what about the energy structures screen. there needs to be a roll bar in that screen, just in case you end up with more energy/special structures, than can be shown. I has a go at modding BOTF to have more structures than could fit. The result was rather...colourful...:lol:

If Sol will be bonused with some extra shipyards what will get Qo'nos? I bet klingon capital is one huge ship factory

One more thought: did you think about some special vulcan building? For example Surak's Academy or Surak's Temple? It can give +diplomacy or +morale.