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Star Trek Fan Games - View topic - Re: Trekwar 0.4.0 Single Player Pre-Alpha Testing
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 Re: Trekwar 0.4.0 Single Player Pre-Alpha Testing 
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02 Jul 2011, 00:09
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I'm not absolutely sure (I was thinking the colony ship issue I mentioned could have something to do with it), but I'll check.

--

At the risk of repeating myself and sounding pushy, here's some thoughts (and recaps) about how I'd see a few things (those mentioned above) working:

- system size (#planets) would be reduced (max 8 or so), and for each planet type the #slots would equal #pop (Terran would have 12 pop and 12 slots - it could be reduced a bit by a mountain range or a sea); each slot would only be unlocked (for construction) when there was enough pop for that to happen, and in case of pop loss buildings would be shut off

- deuterium production in a system would be greatly reduced, and the Hydrogen Extractor (high deuterium production) would be available at tech level 5 or so (to support mid to late game fleets), making nebulae and deuterium silos more important

- colony ships would have a fixed set of initial buildings (the bare minimum) and pop, and no troops, and they'd cost pop (the amount they create) to build; with slots being unlocked by pop (1st bullet point above), this amount of pop would have to be enough to provide space for all the initial buildings, which would also have to be placed in a certain way (not randomly)

- colonization time would depend on the number and type of planets in the system, instead of being a fixed amount per turn; the more colonization modules, and the higher their level (which already depends on Biotech level), the lower that time (as explained in a previous post); maybe explore the possibility of having more than one colony ship in a fleet colonizing a system, for more initial buildings and pop and lower time

- troops would be created (a fixed amount) with Military Outposts, which would cost pop to build - troops costing pop to recruit with the automatic recruitment the game uses would be bad, as each turn you'd be getting pop from growth rate and "spending" it on recruitment

- food would be replaced (?) with something representing Happiness/Habitability/Pollution(lack of) - farms/weather grids/etc would increase it, industry/power/etc would decrease it; this could then affect pop growth rate, and morale (not sure if it is for troops only?) [and taxes if they'd be implemented]



---

As for the refueling issue, the player, if up to it, could move the ship to refuel to the tanker fleet (or create a fleet just for the 2 ships) and an order would be available that would transfer fuel from the tanker to the ship. It'd take a bit of work but it's better than nothing. The tanker should always keep enough fuel to return to a friendly star system of course. If more than one ship is being refueled and there isn't enough fuel to refill them all, fuel is split between all ships so that they have the same final amount of fuel (not according to capacity).


02 Jul 2011, 11:19
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Don't be afraid to sound pushy, this is exactly the kind of feedback I wanted :)

I might not have responded to ALL your points, but I've made notes of them and I'll be going through this thread and the survey that will be sent out next weekend or so, before I define the tasks required for the next alpha version and doing some redesigning.


02 Jul 2011, 11:26
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Ok, I'll keep firing away. :wink: I might have some observations about the ship design debate, but I have to check it better first.

I've edited the post above a bit in some of the bullet points.


02 Jul 2011, 11:49
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02 Jul 2011, 14:40
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Never tried it with OpenJDK, Guess I'll have to do that for next alpha test


02 Jul 2011, 14:55
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Testing Progress Report

I'm finally drafting up a report here from all the notes I've taken so far. Being how there are so many bugs to report, I've found that some seem to have a common element to them. I'll also make some observations here, and some suggestions. Finally, there's a checklist of finished objectives.

Bugs:

1) Colony ship sometimes disappears after colonising a planet. Either it's a constant feature, or not, unknown. Suggestion- it should be stricken from the ship list due cannibalising it for the new colony

2) At least one planet was not allowed to be colonised (error message as such)

3) Initially, logging off of the server halted turn progress. However, this is no longer so- as I write this it is over 5000 turns and progresses after logging off.

4) Ship Designer- could not save a template until a warp core was selected to be installed, even if it was removed afterward. Makes sense not to be able to save a useless ship, but still can do so.

5) Game will lock up if an order is made during turn change

6) Game will lock up if a new option is available, and used for the first time (example- Bunker2, Weather Control)

7) Game lock up on demolish power plant (only one instance?) many of these types of lockups happen, but cannot be repeated a second time.

8) Turn advance halt on trying to overmaximise mini-map. Large Intel map blanks out except for a small region. Other functions still accessible. Used option to log onto server- was able to do so, turns had advanced, but still frozen in display. This also happened after first battle with Lursa, but was able to re-log successfully. A later instance was caused by unknown factor.

9) Game lockup on "Hurry Production" order- seen only on first (or second) building turn- may be recurring- needs to be verified.

10) Game locked up when 2 ships were added to the build queue in shipyard (uncertain if recurring)

11) Game lockup when ship was ordered twice during the same turn to move to another fleet

12) Game lockup when a large number of course orders were given to different ships in same turn (unconfirmed)

13) Cannot invade system. I created troop ships for this occasion, with no result at all

14) Error in troop transfer from planet to ship- message states "Transfer to planet name" instead of from planet

15) Final battle with Chang resulted in major error- screen flashes "Fetching Data From Server" message every 2 seconds, turn countdown often shows negative numbers, no resolution after numerous attempts to re-log onto server (Info- his fleet consisted of 7 battleships and 5 heavy cruisers, as well as a colony ship and a scout present. My fleet consisted of 1 scout, 2 colony ships, 1 light freighter, and 16 Galaxy class ships) (Note 2- I did send a previous fleet before this, consisting of 6 Consitution and 10 Excelsiors, which was utterly defeated)

Observations:

1) No indication of mining order given to ship during same turn, but does the order next turn

2) No indication of colonisation order given to ship during same turn, but does the order next turn

3) No indication of invade system order given to ship during same turn (doesn't seem to work, either)

4) No indication of decommission ship order given, does not do order the next turn

5) No indication of self destruct order given, does not do order the next turn

6) No numerical indication of ship course order during same turn

7) If you hold a build drop during a turn change, but wait until turn change is complete, game will not crash

8) Build queue allows current build to be moved up or down, but continues at top on next turn. However, a switch will be allowed if it is still on the first turn of its build

9) "Hurry Production" order was initially only available for ships, but noted later that it was also available for buildings

10) Signing onto chat showed 5 instances of my account in later stages, also when text is sent, there is also 5 instances of that text displayed in the chat viewer

Suggestions / Comments:

1) I like the "Hurry Production" feature

2) I would expect there to be a "Decolonise system" option available. This is subject to later features and limitations, I'm assuming

3) I understand that Factories increase industrial capability, and decreases build times. However, other than improving build times for ships and more buildings, at this point they are the only product being produced

4) The music gets annoying very quickly, but that's common with every game :P

5) The ship piloting system is functional, but it's also somewhat clumsy, and confusing if overlaps other ship courses. I'd like to see ship functions available in a mini popup right with the ship, rather than go across the screen todo it. Also- windows often tend to block course destinations and need to be moved, or the map scrolled in order to plot them, especially a longer flight

6) Ship information window is handy, but needs improvement. Installed features need to be displayed, such as bussard collectors, and cargo space- especially if partially full. Suggest changing "hit points" to "hull" (??)

7) "Cost to build" information is odd- some ships have different rates, while others have none at all. Not implemented, I assume

8) I realise this is in early testing phases, but will there be some kind of limitation to ship building? At this point, there is no limit to the number of ships that can be built at once

9) Turn Report works well and is informative. Emergency situations would be better addressed if they were made more apparent, especially if one forgets to check the log

10) When building ships, the "Space Dock" box should be labelled "Ship Yard", in my opinion. It would be easier just to click the type you want and confirm build rather than dragging it

11) Map grid co-ords will be an important term to understand and employ. Clicking on empty grids should at least show the grid co-ords, if nothing else

Other than all the bugs, and shortcomings, I must say that at this point it's a strong build. There was a learning curve involved, but that's expected. It would have been easier if a good tutorial were available. However, once the functions have been discovered, and how they relate to other factors in game, it's pretty easy to do what you need to do for the most part. I would enjoy playing this with much slower turn rates, in order to maximise your capabilities during each turn. This also limits how much one can do over time as well. There is much room for improvement here, which includes a certain ruleset that governs a large number of players on the same server, more features than currently present. Even with the bugs and shortcomings, I did enjoy playing this game in its present condition.

Finally! My current Goal status:

Colonize at least 4 new systems (5 total). DONE
Colonize at least 9 new systems (10 total) DONE
Collect and return minerals from an asteroid belt DONE
Reach a lvl 5 technology DONE
Reach 3 lvl 5 technologies DONE
Reach a lvl 10 technology DONE
Unlock the Raptor/Oberth class ship DONE
Unlock the K'vort/Constitution class ship DONE
Unlock the Vor'cha/Galaxy class ship DONE
Unlock the Civillian Barge class ship DONE
Explored about 25% of the map DONE
Explored about 50% of the map DONE
Explored almost 100% of the map DONE
Destroyed Lursa's fleet DONE
Destroyed Gowron's fleet DONE
Destroyed Chang's fleet (the one in his star system) FAILED, HUNG UP
Destroyed Chang's fleet (the one positioned somewhere else) DONE
Invaded Lursa's system UNABLE
Invaded Gowron's system UNABLE
Invaded Changs's system
Built a ship with a speed of at least 40.
Built a ship that can refuel from a nebula.
Built a ship with at least 6 sensor modules.
Gotten a star system population to about 100% UNCERTAIN


02 Jul 2011, 22:37
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03 Jul 2011, 01:31
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03 Jul 2011, 03:06
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03 Jul 2011, 11:13
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This is what I got on a new colony:

Farm
Factory
3x Power
Lab
Shipyard
Deuterium Plant
Ore Refinery

3x Power is definitely too much, the Ore Refinery is probably not a basic structure for a new colony, and neither the Shipyard.

The system had 8 planets + 2 GGs. Initial pop was 0,60 from what I could tell, for the 8 planets; but clicking on each individual I think each planet started with 100 pop (0.1). Also, they all were getting the same pop increase each turn (even though the displayed growth rates were different).


03 Jul 2011, 12:59
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After some more tries, I think the game is not playable on openJDK in its curent state... Mostly because of freezes and unresponsive UI... I'll try with the official JRE today or tomorrow


03 Jul 2011, 15:18
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03 Jul 2011, 15:55
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03 Jul 2011, 16:29
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03 Jul 2011, 16:33
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Sorry i havent read much of this topic just a few bits at the start. Anyhow this is how im finding it after 5 mins lol.

Logged in to the beta and turns were going so fast and i had no idea where to start as theirs not much info i could find as to what things are, how to do things etc. So was wondering if someone could write up a short tutorial on how to do a few things to get me going.

Found a somewhat tutorial in the email i got. So far i figured how to now move ships, colonise a system. I was trying to view a system and it just is confusing what im supose to be doing. I duno what my food/industry/researc/intel is overall for the whole system so duno what im lacking or in abundence. I was reading about the how to build things which in middle columne u drag to a box on the left in one of the planets, but whcih one needs what? To me trying to manage all them planets individually is too much i fear. Would be better imo if it took botf way and had 1 system one set of things to manage for that system. I know alot of us wanted to micro manage the planets individually but atm that is very confusing to do and would be very time consuming. The ui isnt intuitive enough to pull it off i fear as well.

Research wise i managed to start some bio thing off, no idea what i need it for or what each level gives u so i duno what my long term plan could be as in botf u could look in library and see what every level gave you. Maybe i overlooked something but i couldnt find anything like this. Just a brief description of what it vaguely is.

Also yeah login details, grr have to re-enter everytime i launch it. Which i think i read will be adjusted to remembering the details in next build.

Not a great fan of the overall UI, too many bold colors for my liking but thats something to talk about after functionality is fully sorted.

Oh and when dragging something to a planet it crashed/hung so had to task manage it off.

And i would love if someone could tell me what the heck to build and on what planet in the starting system. And how to find out what is needed on each planet. As frankly im at a loss as to what the heck to do in the system view lol. In botf i would just build indusry if needed, food if starvation, etc but i know nothing of what is what in a system view.

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03 Jul 2011, 23:05
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You don't have to worry about what you build on specific planets, the starsystem pools all it's resources together (so farms on one planet will provide food for everyone in the system). Some structures will be planet specific later on, and give special bonuses. So, not all planets needs farms, and there is no requirements per planet.

Since food does not mean much yet, building labs and industry would be a good bet. Industry for building ships later on, labs to help research go along faster.. Power just to supply other structures with power.

I'm working on a new UI for the star system box that will be more informative and intuitive in regards to managing resources (food, power, industry, research). So far there is not many exciting structures to build (except for maybe the listening post/subspace scanner, and a shipyard).


03 Jul 2011, 23:24
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The servers will shut down in 24 hours (july 5th 18:00 GMT).

Everyone who participated should have gotten an email with the link to a survey regarding the alpha test


04 Jul 2011, 17:20
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Crap. Hope it's not too late for some more observations:


The Deuterium Plant in new colonies might not make sense, as the system might not have Gas Giants.


Research screen
---------------

clicking around in tech boxes, some of the icons of unlocked components will disappear. Once I even had quite a few of my techs disappear momentarily (from tech level 6, 2 branches went to level 2).

tech description typos:
Bio 6 - preassure -> pressure ; planets -> planet's
Energy 0 - ...
Energy 1 - defenseive -> defensive



Ship Design
-----------

Some component icons are not centered properly in the ship slots (Warp Core, Sensor Array, etc).
The level of the component is not displayed always in the same corner (lower left, upper right, etc) of the image for different components (for consistency).
The Warp Core 1 doesn't have its level displayed in the icon.

Ships have 10 energy by default.
A Warp Core 2 should give an aditional +10 Energy, but it only gives +8; a WC1 +3 instead of +5. It's diminishing returns, but doesn't it make the displayed component info somewhat misleading and irrelevant?

Every component (except armor) gives the ship -10 armor and +10 HPs; kind of irrelevant?
Also, the armor component gives it +50 armor, and +10 HPs (by default I guess), effectively giving the ship +60 "hull" instead of 50.
Shield emitters give the ship +10 shields more than they should (shield 2 should give +80, gives +90).
Some components don't display their bonuses (like the Deuterium Tanks etc)

component description typos:
Armor - ships -> ship's
Colonization Module - equiptment -> equipment
Bussard Collector - nebulas -> nebulae
Impulse Drive - manouverable -> ?

The info about hulls in the "Hull info" help window doesn't match the ships' stats.

hull description typos:
Miranda - destoyer -> destroyer


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04 Jul 2011, 18:56
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04 Jul 2011, 19:32
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Í was comparing those stats with those of an empty hull (no components) :wink:


04 Jul 2011, 19:47
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04 Jul 2011, 19:49
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Pop growth decreases with increasing pop in the planet; I'm assuming that's intended, and the numbers in the wiki are the base GRs (they're not up to date BTW).

The adjacent colonies issue (+15 / -1 scan strength), don't know if it's relevant, but the -1 SS system is grayed out in the starmap (as if not being inside the range of a scanning source).


04 Jul 2011, 20:35
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04 Jul 2011, 23:01
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05 Jul 2011, 12:09
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Some more typos:

Weapons 7 description
therby -> thereby

Subspace Scanner description
satelites -> satellites
improves -> improve
strenght -> strength
surounding -> surrounding

---

Was this a randomly generated scenario, or a custom one? Star systems were somewhat placed in clusters of 2~4 stars.

You shouldn't be able to start researching a tech that you already researched.

You can save a ship with negative Agility.

When orbiting an uninhabited system, you can't see the types of planets it has (no View option). You do know how many planets, structures, Deuterium, etc though.

Is shield recharge constant or does it depend on number and level of shields? 2 shields lvl 3 (+140 each) recharged 50 per turn, but didn't check any other situations.

In a star system with 3 Volcanic planets, each one had its own growth rate, quite different from each other, and they all had the same pop.


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05 Jul 2011, 23:15
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