Yay! Our missing resident Klingon is back!

What do you think of Jarok's Klingon shiplist, SonOfMogh? I think it sounds perfect for the game, but your expert eye will be more reliable than mine! (Only coz i'm Romulan though...)

I don't really mind if the K'Vort is modelled as a totally new ship, or an upscaled B'rel - but only if my previous post is acknowledged!

HEY! SON OF MOGH IS BACK
Hope you had a nice talk with the Emperor!

I have nothing to say, for the thread unfortunately...
well, except

Scimitar? You want it in as a production-line ship? Well, Ok, but when I saw the movie it just looked... Well, I'd think the Sovereing was some scrapyard ship compared to it. Ok, longer build time, more fuel consumption, so I guess it could work!

A question; The Prometheus, what power will it have in the game? Soveregn-like, or less (if less, how much so?) I was a pretty darn powerful ship in the "Message in a bottle", as soon as the EMH-s found out what the big red buton does, the Prometheus took out a D'Deridex in about 5 seconds (granted, it was already damaged, but 5 sec )

No, sorry, I must have worded my posts a bit wrong.

What I mean is, the Romulan uber-ship should be Scimitar-based

It won't be the Scimitar, coz...well, just like you said CVN!

I don't want to incur the wrath of any trek purists out there either, and having the Scimitar as a ship class, instead of as a one-off, might aggrevate them! Of course, a new ship would do equally as much to aggrevate them...bit of a catch 22 there...

On the plus side, having a new ship would allow the modellers to have a bit of fun, and I for one think that it wouldn't be much of a stab in the dark, if they follow the D'Deridex design/design parameters.

...

I was wondering about the strength of the Prommie as well. As an individual ship, I would imagine the Prommie was weaker than a Sovereign - but when Multi-Vector Assault Mode is engaged, each 'ship' is able to commence the attack, as controlled by the computer.

This allows the 'ships' to attack any weak points on an enemy target (Like from behind, say) in unison, or individual 'ships' could draw the enemies fire away from the two other 'ships'. They could also move out of weapons range while they recharge their weapons, whilst still leaving the two other 'ships' to attack.

This is why the Prommie was so powerful. Multi-Vector Assault Mode allows a ship to be far more flexible than any ordinary ship would be able to. The fact that it also allows you to form your own mini-fleet is an obvious advantage as well!

The ability to 'swarm' and surround the enemy is what allowed the Prommie to take out the Warbird so easily, but even then, it should be a powerful ship.

While I obviously doubt that the Multi-Vector Assault Mode will be available in BOTF, I imagine that the Prommie would have extremely fast recharging shields. I also imagine her as not having a particularly high range (In comparison to a 'Strike Cruiser' say - which isn't going to be in BOTF2 by the way) but for it to be devastating in short-range combat.

That's how I see the Prommie attempting to take out my fleets...it won't work of course...

"Experimental prototype, designed for deep space tactical assignments"
"It's designed to go faster than anything in the fleet"
Aproximate quotes, if memory serves, from VGR "Message in a bottle" Sounds pretty long-ranged to me

I guess I DID misread your post. You did say BASED ON the Scimitar design; glad to see you think the Scimitar itself is a tad too much

By 'short range', I was referring to her tactical capabilites!

Of course the Prommie is meant to be long range, but in actual battles, she doesn't blast enemies with torpedoes whilst out of range of any enemies - she tears enemy shields to shreds with her phasers and torpedoes, overwhelming and destroying them...not taking pot shots like a 'Strike Cruiser' would.

Does this make sense? 8O

Thanks for the welcomes back guys!

Work has been crazy busy of late, (lots of rogue Jem Hadar to kill!). I'll be reading through and catching up with it all tomorrow. Very very impressed with this thread from what I've seen.

Finally someone else on this site has read a ST book. Yeah Tales is a great collection, read any other good books, Jarok?

Ok, I decided to go straight to the source earlier today, and asked Jiggly about our questions regarding the Scimitar, and the Promethius. Instead of explaining it, heres what was said.
Rygel says:
have you guys decided if the Scimitar will be included as a Rom uber ship?
jigalypuff says:
yes it will be a rom ship
jigalypuff says:
dunno if any ships will be uber though
Rygel says:
well, on the boards, people were trying to decide what the roms "answer" to the Soverign/Vor'Cha would be. Some said go with the Scimitar, but others didnt like that because in the movie, that ship was quite "uber"
jigalypuff says:
if it was so uber why`d it get blown to bits
Rygel says:
lol, good point
jigalypuff says:
the reman schimitar will be a rom production ship, an answer to the sov and vor`cha

Regading the Prommie
Rygel says:
If the Promethius is included, I doubt you guys will want to give it that multi-vector assualt mode, so will there be anything special about it compared to other ships?
jigalypuff says:
it will have multi vector assualt mode
Rygel says:
really, that oughta look cool
jigalypuff says:
armada has it so will we

I went on to ask if one of the three parts is destroyed, what would happen to the ship? Jig said that most likelyeven in the multi vector mode, the ship will only count as one model, so even if only one of te three parts is taking damage, that damage will be spread across the ship as a whole.

Hope that helps us all clear up a few issues.

MULTI-VECTOR ASSAULT MODE?!?!
<shudders and faints in disbelief>

Scimitar... Well, I don't agree, but it's not like I have a choice!

Thanks for the info, Riglel!

8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O

I think i'm gonna faint...Multi-Vector Assault Mode is in?

I'm in shock...disbelief...but it's a small price to pay!

We're gonna have Multi-Vector Assault Mode!

Im not sure if I should say "Your welcome." or ask who this Riglel is....

Switching sides now, are we Matress...
You finaly realise NOTHING can resist the Federation, especial now that it is complete with MV Assault Mode (:twisted: )

Oh and, Riglel, sorry ; dyslecsic fingers...

Oh please, did you really think that the Multi-Vector Assault Mode was going to stay in your hands?

Does the Prommie being stolen by Romulans mean anything to you CVN? 8O

So my operatives failed in their mfirst attempt. So what? They failed where others shall succeed. The Star Empire is invincibibble!

That DID slip my mind...

Then again, you were defeated by TWO holograms...
Next time the Federation will only post ONE hologram so the Romulans have a fair chance

And then again, you DID manage to anesthasise the entire crew...
We'll call it a tie!:wink:

This is all very excting.

The MVAM should be simple enough, considering the game still treats the ship as one.

The Scimitar was so Uber mainly due to the cloaking technology. Looking at the damage just one spread of Quantums did, I'd say that without the uber-cloak, the Sovereign would be roughly equal.

Aside from SOM's last post, i think theres a bit of the Matress Effect (see http://botfii.armadafleetcommand.com/in ... &&start=15 ) running around this board.

Yeah, SOM.

The quantums did a lot of superficial damage, and even reduced the shields a whole THIRTY PERCENT!!! 8O :lol::lol:

Sure, the cloak was the primary advantage, but it seemed like Scimitars' shields were the single most formidable part of that ship!

I still think that the canon Scimitar would be a nice ubership, but would prefer a Romulan design! (I guess it's settled, though, so I'll shut up about it)

Really, whatever you guys decide will be awesome! I don't care what we get, as long as we don't have Invincible FerengiTM!

God, dont even get me started. I hated BOTf's portrayal of the Ferengi (Can we say completely f@&#ing crazy?). Just for the sheer annoyance they usually caused me in the original, every time i see the Ferengi in BOTF2, I swear, whether I am Fed, Kling, Rom, whoever, I will always conquer them. The Ferengi will forever know my wrath.

Seriously - does anyone else have stories of the Invincible FerengiTM?

Was it just a bug that let them build fifty bazillian ships? or was the computer cheating with money? And how come if you 'retired' to check your progress, the Feregi were almost ALWAYS on top???

Add to the annoyance the power of the War Cruiser II's - so basically early in the game, if you meet them, you're screwed, and if you fight them in the late part of the game (but before you get to the top of your tech tree) you're screwed again, because there are 50,000 WCII's against three heavy cruisers...

Doom......Doom.......Doom.......Doom


The Ferengi must be punished for their offenses in BoTF I!

Maybe a Light Raider could appear randomly and just sit there for you to destroy? (and set it up so you can hear the screams!)

Here are some lovely Haiku to better show my feelings....

Met the Ferengi
My empire was looking good
now most likely doomed.



Stupid Ferengi
My fleet was quite powerful
But now it is gone.



Sadness fills the void
Defeat inevitable
They will pay one day

The reason why the Ferengi could build so many ships, is that their particular starship advantage was cheaper build costs.

This was probably meant as an offshoot of their economic power, (They can buy/steal some parts instead of manufacturing them) but it obviously went wrong. The programmers wanted each race to have a particular strength when it came to starship design, so they gave the Federation better shields, the Klingons lotsa weapons, the Romulans a cloak, the Cardassians lotsa hull, and the Ferengi cheap build costs.

By the looks of things, it went wrong because they didn't bother to offset the cheapness of their ships by also weakening them in strength...thus leading to their apparent invincibility.

Luckily, the Ferengi won't be in as a playable race, so you shouldn't have to worry too much about them. Of course, they will pop up somewhere, as they always do, but we can kill them when the time comes.

...

I sort of have a story of Ferengi invincibility, but it comes from the opposite side...I was the Ferengi! 8O

I was up against a Klingon battlefleet (I had decided that I just wanted to *&$£ them off, just so I could see my Ferengi fleets get wiped out)

Yeah...that's exactly what didn't happen!

I had four Raider 2's, against a Vor'cha, twelve B'rel two's and two K'tinga two's.

I decided that I wanted a long, drawn out battle, so I decided that I would set my ships to constantly evade. In the first turn, I pretty much wiped out the B'rels with a volley of torpedoes - which surprised me really, considering that I every one of my forced plasma beams missed! 8O

When I realised that I was winning, I turned my ships to harry the two K'tinga's. Because my ships were all over the place from the previous evading, they weren't able to fire many of their torpedoes, but I got some decent plasma beam shots at them, and I pretty much took out their shields.

After that, I set three of the ships to charge at the Vor'cha, while the remaining ship polished off the K'tinga's!

I couldn't believe it when I won...considering I was preparing to watch my ships die! I've modded them to be far weaker now!

Let's make the Ferengi a random event, in the form of their ship orbiting some system. We'll call it... MAXIA.
If you kill them you get a massive morale bonus

And, regarding the Ferengi being overpowered in the game, I agree they were portrayed mightier then they realy are (I just used the words realy are, for a race in a fictional TV show... fascinating...)

Oh, It's realy nice wathcing Defiants cut through the little ear-deformed bastards... Actualy, it's realy nice wathcing Defiants cut through everything...
Now that is a powerful ship! What do you think, should it be somewhat power-deprived for BotF2?

How can the Defiant be over-powered? You're gonna need it to be souped-up to be able to take on my Navy!

...

I think the Defiant should have weapons that the same as in the show, as in 1 Quantum launcher, four pulse phaser cannons, and three phaser arrays.

The Quantums can do the standard 100 points of damage or whatever (As in BOTF) the phasers can do 70 points of damage, and the cannons could do...say, 90 points of damage (So 5x4x90 = 1800 points of damage!)

Of course, this is based on the pulses firing five times. If it is going to be adjusted, then the damage will be as follows: -

1 pulse = 360 damage
2 pulses = 720 damage
3 pulses = 1080 damage
4 pulses = 1440 damage
5 pulses = 1800 damage
6 pulses = 2160 damage
10 pulses = 3600 damage
100 pulses = 36000 damage

and so on

As you can see, the cannons could become quite devastating, so this is why the other weapons should be limited in number (As in the series)

Even if a single pulse did the same damage as an array, the total cannon damage would be 1400 damage with pulses pulses!

I'm basing the five pulses on the sound effects, not the onscreen evidence, since the sound effect often had five pulses. (Although I admit not always)

So yes, the Defiant may need a slight underpowering CVN - not that you have a hope, even with this rediculous amount of damage...

"Misdirection is the key to survival"?
Well, Romulans ARE a bit misdirected and misguided

Oh, Defiants are gonna kick some Beta Quadrant a$$!

Anyone know how the Dominion ships will be sorted out?
Like I said, we saw only about 3 designs...

the ferengi in the botf i play was crap, and thats them in tech 3 and me 1 from the start, thiers that many bugs in the game and exploits, ya can easily have 500 dreadnaught 2's by turn 200-250

Well, for most of my BOTF playing experience was done on an unmodded game, so I got to see the Ferengi for what they truly wern't.

CVN, if you really want to know about the Dominion ships, ask Jig, or Dafedz since they are the ones doing most, if not all of the ship design for the game.

Agreed Number One.

Every ship will have it's good and bad points, the Defiant's biggest plus is the power of her pulse phasers. A lot of people are obviously worried the ship will be uber, as it was in BOTF, the problem with BOTF was the bloody defence rating ships had, (this dictated how easily targettable a ship was). The Defiant's was so high, most ships couldn't hit her standing still.

In this game, the ship will be maneuverable, but not impossible to hit. If her pulse weapons are really beefy, (similar power to a Galaxy phaser strike with each pulse), larger ships will have the advantage of being able to sustain an assault on her even as she passes- due to their massive advantage in coverage.

Just to show what a true nerd I am, here are the Defiant's entire compliment of weapons, (as actually shown firing on screen);

4 Pulse Phaser Cannons- (fire simultaneously)
1 Dorsal Phaser Bank- (fires beam)
1 Forward Phaser Bank- (in deflector housing)
2 Forward Quantum Launchers- (fire simultaneously)
1 Forward Photon Launcher- (in deflector housing)
1 Aft Photon Launcher- (dead centre of aft)


Ps- Super Ferengi out... 'Minor Race' Ferengi in!!!

These two + a probe launcher + a tractror-beam emitter are ALL housed in the same opening on the deflector.


Just to show what a truer nerd I am

Mate, we saw in TNG all the time that probes are generally fired from photon torpedo launchers, there's no need for extra equipment.

I'm not doubting you in any way, but when did the Defiant use a forward tractor beam? I remember seeing something similar but I can't remember where from...

form http://www.ditl.org

Not a tractor, as it turns out but rather and "Energy beam".
Still, a bit odd a phaser emitter/torpedo bay fireing an "Energy beam"...

Oh right OK. In that case then, we could assume that since a phaser is directed energy, that energy beam could quite easily be a specially tuned phaser beam.

In that case the only things that would need to be crammed in the deflector housing would be a photon launcher- for photons and probes, and a phaser bank- for phasers and 'energy beams'.

She is a fine ship.